Too often, science folks try to use ONLY the portion of reality called the “physical-seen world” to explain everything, but the physical world cannot explain the systems at play. It ends up being a tug of war/struggle between science and folks who believe there is more than just the physical world. Really unnecessary…. but in many cases a self-defense mechanism/response towards religious folks who posit unreasonable and unprovable beliefs based on the concept that there is “something unseen out there”, and it is “X” or “Y”. When the infighting calms down, the fact is that science has already begun showing us that there is an underlying world, and that there is a mutual influence between the various levels of existence.
The point is made by the use of the term “extra physical” (or supernatural) …… when a person realizes that everything which exists is connected and a part of everything else, then there can be no “extra” or “outside” thing (not one and not two) …. and the best term for that is reality….. not “physical and extra physical” or “natural and supernatural”….. that is where the whole conversation goes off the tracks and just becomes an excuse to argue……
Some further thoughts….
imho, i don’t like the term “spiritual”, and opt for “Deep Nature” as a term for “that which we cannot see” or “that which we to date cannot measure scientifically”…. i have thrown out the term “supernatural” (i class this incorrect assumption as chasm theology where the root of everything is dualism: good vs. evil) ……. anyways, it brought me to reading about the struggles regarding the concept of “Superdeterminism”… then I went and refreshed about the EPR paradox, and the Bell theorem….. (yikes…. tested my focusing ability! ) and also how Einstein worked his whole life to try to bring a unified theory that covered both quantum mechanics and reality….. i think we all have theories about how reality works, and many of them do not have experimental data to support them, but DO have experiential data….. It seems even Einstein might have been saying “don’t say you know if you don’t know”….. yet even he had theories that they had to spend decades to build the equipment to test….. he was simply clear in his own mind, and so he set forth those theoretical positions…..He said that he felt there were forces which we do not yet recognize that once we recognize them will fill in the “gaps”…… (and THAT is what i like about science)again, imho, the question is one of “worldview”. So, i am going to ask this question “what if the root of everything is awareness?”….. then, as Shunryu Suzuki said “Time for a general housecleaning of the mind”….. because most if not all of our assumptions are that dichotomy extends to the root of everything…. and i don’t go with that.